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Results Question  Go to page  [1] 2
finny3
Mon Mar 02 2015, 10:02AM
Registered Member #10243
Joined: Thu Mar 11 2010, 07:31AM
Posts: 20
Is finishing 4th at MA Allstates and 7/8th at New Englands likely to mean that wrestler is good enough to wrestle in college? D3 anyway?
Carlascooz
Mon Mar 02 2015, 10:08AM
Registered Member #11519
Joined: Sun Jan 22 2012, 09:43PM
Posts: 254
finny3 wrote ...

Is finishing 4th at MA Allstates and 7/8th at New Englands likely to mean that wrestler is good enough to wrestle in college? D3 anyway?


He would definetly get recruited and even be the best recruit (on paper) for some D3 schools. But college wrestling is wholly different than high school. So, the wrestler decribed above might have good paper but he might never start or even win a match in college. And at the same time, someone he may have beaten in high school could go on to be an NCAA All-American.
Jim Maher
Mon Mar 02 2015, 10:09AM

Joined: Mon Mar 29 2004, 08:09PM
Posts: 4726
Yes, some wrestlers just thrive at the College level. Depends on the kid.
finny3
Mon Mar 02 2015, 10:19AM
Registered Member #10243
Joined: Thu Mar 11 2010, 07:31AM
Posts: 20
good feedback. I do think toughness plays a big role in college succes
FlipU4Real
Mon Mar 02 2015, 10:46AM
Registered Member #571
Joined: Mon Sep 13 2004, 09:33PM
Posts: 590
The thing I think we all agree upon, is that this "paper" isn't enough to determine if someone is "good enough" to wrestle in college. They would not be at the top of anyone's recruiting list, but a good attitude, work ethic, and other factors could make them either a successful college wrestler, or at least a worthy team member.
Generally, someone 4th at All-State would need to improve significantly to be competitive even at the D3 level, but this happens all the time with good coaching and working hard.

Also, a lot of kids who didn't start wrestling until HS are still are the steep part of their learning curve (meaning they can get significantly better in the next few years).

Point of the story... if you have the interest and desire, go for it. Don't be afraid to seek out and contact college coaches yourself. They will welcome your call.
finny3
Mon Mar 02 2015, 11:06AM
Registered Member #10243
Joined: Thu Mar 11 2010, 07:31AM
Posts: 20
Ok, so Top 8 in New Englands means you still have to improve a lot to wrestle in D3?
LoganDWC
Mon Mar 02 2015, 11:09AM
Registered Member #35
Joined: Wed Mar 24 2004, 09:16PM
Posts: 86
Website
High school stats don't always correlate directly to college success. Many wresters develop at different rates. As long as you are willing to work hard and balance school/workouts and everything that comes along with being a college athlete you can find success. There's also a difference between making it through a college program and finding success on the mat. Just making it through a college program for 4 years is a tremendous accomplishment. Even if the kid doesn't find much success on the mat they will still become a better person and it will benefit them in life tremendously. I agree with what someone said above in that many kids who start wrestling as freshman may just be starting to figure it out by their senior year. I myself started wrestling as a freshman in high school, took 4th at all states as a senior, went on to wrestle d3 and made all conference twice my junior/senior year. I also coached at the college level and saw first hand that high school accomplishments don't always translate to the college level. I encourage any senior to wrestle in college (if that's what you want to do) regardless of your accomplishments in high school.
Rabidvik
Mon Mar 02 2015, 11:09AM
Registered Member #11946
Joined: Fri Mar 02 2012, 02:32PM
Posts: 15
I never placed at NEs and won far more than I lost in Div2. You may not be recruited but if you want it enough you will make it what you want. Walk on and commit to excelling.
Carlascooz
Mon Mar 02 2015, 11:17AM
Registered Member #11519
Joined: Sun Jan 22 2012, 09:43PM
Posts: 254
finny3 wrote ...

Ok, so Top 8 in New Englands means you still have to improve a lot to wrestle in D3?


You need to improve a lot no matter what. College wrestling is totally different. A multi-time NE champ wouldn't even be a lock for Top 6 in D-III New Englands in college if he doesn't get MUCH better.
FlipU4Real
Mon Mar 02 2015, 11:43AM
Registered Member #571
Joined: Mon Sep 13 2004, 09:33PM
Posts: 590
finny3 wrote ...

Ok, so Top 8 in New Englands means you still have to improve a lot to wrestle in D3?


In many cases, yes, but that's not the point. The point is that in most cases you CAN wrestle in D3... just with varying levels of success.
If improving isn't already part of the plan, then no, i wouldn't bother.
NEU_wrestling
Mon Mar 02 2015, 11:47AM
Registered Member #12671
Joined: Sun Nov 04 2012, 07:12PM
Posts: 99
No matter what, there needs to be improvement. The person cant stay the same. Im not saying a NE placewinner wont crack a lineup, but they cant be the same person they are in HS than college. There a huge difference between HS and College.
s.shore
Mon Mar 02 2015, 01:29PM
Registered Member #14212
Joined: Fri Dec 19 2014, 10:44AM
Posts: 56
QHS wrote ...

No matter what, there needs to be improvement. The person cant stay the same. Im not saying a NE placewinner wont crack a lineup, but they cant be the same person they are in HS than college. There a huge difference between HS and College.


I'm confused about this HUGE difference?....how is it different?. Are we talking about skill level? I need this HUGE difference explained. I'm not getting it. It could be something obvious that I'm missing.
Carlascooz
Mon Mar 02 2015, 01:42PM
Registered Member #11519
Joined: Sun Jan 22 2012, 09:43PM
Posts: 254
s.shore wrote ...

QHS wrote ...

No matter what, there needs to be improvement. The person cant stay the same. Im not saying a NE placewinner wont crack a lineup, but they cant be the same person they are in HS than college. There a huge difference between HS and College.


I'm confused about this HUGE difference?....how is it different?. Are we talking about skill level? I need this HUGE difference explained. I'm not getting it. It could be something obvious that I'm missing.



The huge difference is the skill (e.g. technique, quickness, strength, toughness, intensity). A typical college NE champ would absolutely kick the sht out of a typical high school NE champ. Like tech him badly.
LoganDWC
Mon Mar 02 2015, 01:59PM
Registered Member #35
Joined: Wed Mar 24 2004, 09:16PM
Posts: 86
Website
s.shore wrote ...

QHS wrote ...

No matter what, there needs to be improvement. The person cant stay the same. Im not saying a NE placewinner wont crack a lineup, but they cant be the same person they are in HS than college. There a huge difference between HS and College.


I'm confused about this HUGE difference?....how is it different?. Are we talking about skill level? I need this HUGE difference explained. I'm not getting it. It could be something obvious that I'm missing.




I would say the huge difference is the fact that everyone in college is an adult. 18-22 years old usually. You wont run into any kids or many "scrubs". Mostly everyone wrestling in college was a stud at their high school. With that being said there are definetely some High School NE champs that could make a splash right away in college.
GrayDawg
Mon Mar 02 2015, 01:59PM
Registered Member #4288
Joined: Thu Sep 07 2006, 09:05PM
Posts: 557
Carlascooz wrote ...

s.shore wrote ...

QHS wrote ...

No matter what, there needs to be improvement. The person cant stay the same. Im not saying a NE placewinner wont crack a lineup, but they cant be the same person they are in HS than college. There a huge difference between HS and College.


I'm confused about this HUGE difference?....how is it different?. Are we talking about skill level? I need this HUGE difference explained. I'm not getting it. It could be something obvious that I'm missing.



The huge difference is the skill (e.g. technique, quickness, strength, toughness, intensity). A typical college NE champ would absolutely kick the sht out of a typical high school NE champ. Like tech him badly.


My vote for "post of the week".
cradleman1952
Mon Mar 02 2015, 02:24PM
Registered Member #278
Joined: Mon Jan 16 2006, 10:06AM
Posts: 1155
Biggest differences for most kids going into College wrestling is the constant daily grind, the constant bumps and bruises, and the level of competition that many New England kids don't see on a weekly basis. The room gets tougher and the expectation is that you are committed. Some high school programs spoil their kids(in a good way) because they have tremendous support. Many kids go to college and are wrestling in front of a handful of fans. Mt. Anthony and Timberlane are two such programs where it becomes an event for the kids. There aren't many programs like that.
finny3
Mon Mar 02 2015, 02:27PM
Registered Member #10243
Joined: Thu Mar 11 2010, 07:31AM
Posts: 20
Would it be fair to say that to compete at the D1 level in college, you should have been placing in the top 2-3 at New Englands probably for multiple years and even then, you might not be good enough?
NEU_wrestling
Mon Mar 02 2015, 02:35PM
Registered Member #12671
Joined: Sun Nov 04 2012, 07:12PM
Posts: 99
finny3 wrote ...

Would it be fair to say that to compete at the D1 level in college, you should have been placing in the top 2-3 at New Englands probably for multiple years and even then, you might not be good enough?


All depends on the program you are at. Cant compare all D1 programs. Sacred Heart vs Ohio State. Both D1 programs but the caliber is different. Even placing 2-3 all 4 years wont makr ypu a stud in D1. Its about the work the athletes do. In the room. In the weight room etc. Wrextling D1 is a job in itself to be the best.
NEU_wrestling
Mon Mar 02 2015, 02:36PM
Registered Member #12671
Joined: Sun Nov 04 2012, 07:12PM
Posts: 99
Coaching,workout partners, work ethic ate just few of many things thaf make you a better wrestler no matter what you finish in HS
Carlascooz
Mon Mar 02 2015, 02:40PM
Registered Member #11519
Joined: Sun Jan 22 2012, 09:43PM
Posts: 254
finny3 wrote ...

Would it be fair to say that to compete at the D1 level in college, you should have been placing in the top 2-3 at New Englands probably for multiple years and even then, you might not be good enough?



What do you mean by "good enough"? Being good enough to get recruited and\or be on the team is not at all the same as being good enough to be successful.
finny3
Mon Mar 02 2015, 03:13PM
Registered Member #10243
Joined: Thu Mar 11 2010, 07:31AM
Posts: 20
Good enough to start, compete, etc. not just be in the room. If we looked at college D1 starters from MA over the past 10 years, I'm guessing most would have finished top 2-3 in NE during high school. If we look at most college D3 starters from MA over the same period, I'd say based on responses to this post, most would have been top 8 in NEs in high school?
Carlascooz
Mon Mar 02 2015, 03:26PM
Registered Member #11519
Joined: Sun Jan 22 2012, 09:43PM
Posts: 254
finny3 wrote ...

... If we looked at college D1 starters from MA over the past 10 years, I'm guessing most would have finished top 2-3 in NE during high school.


I'd say that's probably true.

finny3 wrote ...

If we look at most college D3 starters from MA over the same period, I'd say based on responses to this post, most would have been top 8 in NEs in high school?


Not sure about that one.

But either way, whether your a high school national champ or took 7th at All-States you're going to have to improve a lot to succeed in NCAA.
LibertyMikeC
Mon Mar 02 2015, 03:37PM
Registered Member #8105
Joined: Sat Nov 22 2008, 02:46PM
Posts: 290
As others mentioned the daily grind at college, longer season, constantly facing other top quality wrestlers, riding time, etc are all factors that make college different than high school. Work ethic, Determination and mental toughness are the things that it takes on top of being skilled. There are those who never won a HS state championship, but then went on to become NCAA National champions (Mitch Clark, Steve Bosak, etc). Jordan Burroughs only won HS States once and then there were others that were 3 time HS State Champs and never reached AA status (Drew Pariano - 3x HS State champ in OH, wrestled for and now head coach at Northwestern.). I've talked to Coach Pariano and he said there are numerous reasons why the HS career doesn't necessarily translate to College. A wrestler who never reached champion in HS, sometimes proves to be more determined and works harder. Certain college coaches have a certain style that they want for the team and it might not be the wrestlers' style. A HS wrestler who accomplished alot of success might not be open to changing his style in college, because it worked for so many years in HS but then is confused when it won't work in college, or loses confidence and that's where the mental toughness is tested. Very successful HS wrestlers aren't used to losing so that first year of college when they are 18/19 and wrestling 22+ older men and losing is tough for them to take
speedkills
Mon Mar 02 2015, 05:20PM
Registered Member #8281
Joined: Sat Dec 27 2008, 10:44AM
Posts: 305
finny3 wrote ...

Good enough to start, compete, etc. not just be in the room. If we looked at college D1 starters from MA over the past 10 years, I'm guessing most would have finished top 2-3 in NE during high school. If we look at most college D3 starters from MA over the same period, I'd say based on responses to this post, most would have been top 8 in NEs in high school?



To complete in D1 level in College, you would need to demonstrate your ability on a National Level, not just NE. Winning or placing in top 3 in some big tournament, ie Super32, Fargo, Flo, Beast of the East, Senior Nationals..etc. D1 skills are much deeper than D2 or D3. National level success and visibility is usually critical, but there are some exceptions as always. If you kid is really interested in D1, I would recommend based on guidance I have been given by some coaches, he should be competing junior and senior year in National recognized tournaments, and place.
pmoricone
Mon Mar 02 2015, 07:07PM
Registered Member #10256
Joined: Mon Mar 15 2010, 10:30AM
Posts: 67
I agree with Jim Mayer on this. Some kids thrive. D1 is a huge commitment. I read a book that says you should be at least a state champion to consider D1 but yes as someone mentioned there are D1 champs that never won states. I don't agree about needing to place at Fargo and other tournaments. My son never went to Fargo or any of the other big tournaments and he had a scholarship and many offers. I will add if you go to a national tournament like Fargo and don't place you won't get an offer other than to walk on.
But I think if you want to abf have the desire you can wrestle in college just realize not everyone is ready for Penn state.
If you are that interested wrestle in college go to a college website and read the wrestlers bios you will get a see many resumes.
Academics play a huge role also especially at D1. Coaches look at grades also.
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