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Wednesday Morning "Scratch" Weigh-Ins? = (NFHS) Rule Violation!  Go to page  [1] 2 3 4
Chicken Wing Coach
Wed Nov 27 2013, 12:05AM

Joined: Tue Apr 01 2008, 05:15PM
Posts: 3789
Please comment & vote on whether or not you agree with this Weigh-In scenario/situation?

*Continue it = Scratch (in morning) plus 3 pounds added at night....

*Eliminate it = Scratch for ALL wrestlers every Wed. night (no allowance)...
WICH1149
Wed Nov 27 2013, 06:32AM
Registered Member #1202
Joined: Mon Jan 24 2005, 10:00AM
Posts: 335
I'm not in favor of either. Plus 3 on Wednesday night weigh in only with no weigh-in in the morning, scratch on the weekends. If I had to pick one of those it would be Continue It.
NEU_wrestling
Wed Nov 27 2013, 08:29AM
Registered Member #12671
Joined: Sun Nov 04 2012, 07:12PM
Posts: 99
it should be scratch at night. Never heard of morning weigh ins before I started coaching up here. This is one reason not so many people can handle wrestling , which is a good thing. separates the men from the boys
nb135
Wed Nov 27 2013, 10:01AM
Registered Member #6515
Joined: Sun Dec 09 2007, 09:42AM
Posts: 1216
continue it
standinggranby
Wed Nov 27 2013, 01:07PM
Registered Member #572
Joined: Tue Sep 14 2004, 11:57AM
Posts: 396
scratch weight 1 hour before match time keeps kids from dropping another weight class. big deference weighing in and having 6 hours then weighing in and wrestling right away,
AHS611
Wed Nov 27 2013, 01:09PM
Registered Member #7279
Joined: Sun Feb 10 2008, 06:15PM
Posts: 330
Continue it.
cradleman1952
Wed Nov 27 2013, 06:25PM
Registered Member #278
Joined: Mon Jan 16 2006, 10:06AM
Posts: 1149
No morning weigh-in. There is no reason/excuse for doing otherwise. Okay , call me old but if we are serious about changing excessive weight cutting and getting rid of the suspicious behavior surrounding the morning weigh-in then you have to cut out the opportunity that is available for this to happen.
determination97
Wed Nov 27 2013, 07:29PM
Registered Member #13076
Joined: Tue Feb 05 2013, 05:28PM
Posts: 5
continue it, it's not fair to some wrestlers that are tight on their weight classes and they need to eat something during the day
Chicken Wing Coach
Wed Nov 27 2013, 08:25PM

Joined: Tue Apr 01 2008, 05:15PM
Posts: 3789
I knew this topic would raise eyebrows & ruffle a few feathers.

I openly vote to get rid of & eliminate this "bogus" procedure as it only promotes the creation of changing the weight class on a weekly basis. *Why do we have weight classes if people manipulate it in this fashion?

I believe that this procedure actually promotes wrestlers to be at a weight class that they shouldn't be at in the first place. It promotes more weight cutting, not less!

If the weight classes were at "scratch" all the time for everybody involved, kids would be much less likely to "go down" by starving & dehydrating themselves. It changes the weight class & I don't believe (for the overall health & general well being of the wrestlers) that it's the right thing to do.

One step further: I'm all for Mat side weigh-ins as they effectively end all weight cutting nonsense & promote what we should be doing (preserving the health of our youngsters).

*I salute the responses given by "QHS" & "mray" is right on the money & simply says it best!
Coach G
Wed Nov 27 2013, 11:35PM
Registered Member #10465
Joined: Sun Sep 12 2010, 09:29PM
Posts: 60
Morning weigh-ins are ridiculous and should be eliminated. If there is some way to vote or petition to eliminate it, please let me know.
WICH1149
Thu Nov 28 2013, 07:18AM
Registered Member #1202
Joined: Mon Jan 24 2005, 10:00AM
Posts: 335
No matter what we do, kids will always be cutting weight. To think that this will somehow stop this is just plain silly. It may prevent huge cuts but it will never eliminate it.
cradleman1952
Thu Nov 28 2013, 09:02AM
Registered Member #278
Joined: Mon Jan 16 2006, 10:06AM
Posts: 1149
WICH1149 wrote ...

No matter what we do, kids will always be cutting weight. To think that this will somehow stop this is just plain silly. It may prevent huge cuts but it will never eliminate it.



You make a good point but just because we can't eliminate it altogether doesn't mean that we shouldn't, at least, try to curtail it as much as possible. Everyone, Have a nice Thanksgiving.
LibertyMikeC
Thu Nov 28 2013, 09:57AM
Registered Member #8105
Joined: Sat Nov 22 2008, 02:46PM
Posts: 289
mray wrote ...

WICH1149 wrote ...

No matter what we do, kids will always be cutting weight. To think that this will somehow stop this is just plain silly. It may prevent huge cuts but it will never eliminate it.



You make a good point but just because we can't eliminate it altogether doesn't mean that we shouldn't, at least, try to curtail it as much as possible. Everyone, Have a nice Thanksgiving.


Exactly, maybe by realizing they are too weak to wrestle at what they weighed in at, will make them realize that it's not healthy. It won't eliminate cutting weight all together, but it will hopefully eliminate the bigger more drastic weight cutting.
AHS611
Thu Nov 28 2013, 10:24PM
Registered Member #7279
Joined: Sun Feb 10 2008, 06:15PM
Posts: 330
eliminate them, and instead of kids cutting the night before, they'll just cut during the two hours after school before they leave for the match and they'll be in worse shape for the match. Won't make any significant positive change.
GrayDawg
Fri Nov 29 2013, 07:55AM
Registered Member #4288
Joined: Thu Sep 07 2006, 09:05PM
Posts: 535
AHS611 wrote ...

eliminate them, and instead of kids cutting the night before, they'll just cut during the two hours after school before they leave for the match and they'll be in worse shape for the match. Won't make any significant positive change.


I think this is an extremely insightful observation..............
AHS611
Fri Nov 29 2013, 08:28AM
Registered Member #7279
Joined: Sun Feb 10 2008, 06:15PM
Posts: 330
GrayDawg wrote ...

AHS611 wrote ...

eliminate them, and instead of kids cutting the night before, they'll just cut during the two hours after school before they leave for the match and they'll be in worse shape for the match. Won't make any significant positive change.


I think this is an extremely insightful observation..............


You used too many periods.
standinggranby
Fri Nov 29 2013, 09:10AM
Registered Member #572
Joined: Tue Sep 14 2004, 11:57AM
Posts: 396
I have seen way too too many kids at Wed night weigh ins, who supposedly already made scratch that morning and got 3 lbs.
Running, spitting in a cup, etc.
RIWRESTLING
Fri Nov 29 2013, 10:45AM
Registered Member #9935
Joined: Fri Feb 05 2010, 03:21PM
Posts: 93
It will never change. Someone will always be trying to get that little advantage. To me it's "cheating the scale" but it doesn't seem like anyone involved wants to see it it really change. I remember an old coach telling me to get in peak physical condition and wherever I ended up that was my weight class. It wasn't about starving, spitting, diuretics, trash bags,sauna suits, laxatives, etc.

Put a scale right beside the mat and weigh what the weight class requires.

GrayDawg
Fri Nov 29 2013, 04:01PM
Registered Member #4288
Joined: Thu Sep 07 2006, 09:05PM
Posts: 535
RIWRESTLING wrote ...

Put a scale right beside the mat and weigh what the weight class requires.


Now THAT- would be awesome. My son wrestled 106 last season as an 8th grader and never weighed in heavier than 95 lbs. With the 2 pound allowance after the 1st of the year, he was giving up 13 pounds to some kids. Anyone want to do the math and calculate what percentage of 95 that 13 pounds is?

So when I hear parents of 152's complaining about their son's opponent being 7 pounds over at the time of the match due to an early weigh in, I just giggle and walk away.

Now my son is 110 pounds and wants to cut 4 pounds. I told him to lift his ass off, eat like a Viking and go 113. Bring the skills of the lighter weight classes up to the heavier weight classes (not that 113 is 'heavy' by any stretch of the imagination, but you get what I mean).
ROBA
Fri Nov 29 2013, 04:11PM
Registered Member #9418
Joined: Wed Dec 02 2009, 12:42PM
Posts: 60
"Mat side weigh-ins".
Most reasonable idea.

My son as a freshman in varsity, in the 138 lb weight class wrestled 152 most of the season. He never even approached 152 and managed a 24-12 season. He enjoyed eating 2 footlong subways (near the scales) before weigh in to reach 142 or 143. I'm not sure weight cutting gives that much of an advantage.
spladelcradel33
Fri Nov 29 2013, 06:18PM
Registered Member #10391
Joined: Sun Jun 27 2010, 09:39PM
Posts: 49
Eliminate it
GrayDawg
Fri Nov 29 2013, 06:36PM
Registered Member #4288
Joined: Thu Sep 07 2006, 09:05PM
Posts: 535
ROBA wrote ...

My son as a freshman in varsity, in the 138 lb weight class wrestled 152 most of the season. He never even approached 152 and managed a 24-12 season. He enjoyed eating 2 footlong subways (near the scales) before weigh in to reach 142 or 143.


I love it !! Every Friday night last year, my son enjoyed a 16+ ounce Porterhouse steak, mashed potatoes, apple pie, chocolate milk....... He wrestled strong all season as an eigth grader. Significant weight cutting results in miserable, worn down wrestlers by the end of the season imho. I'll have my son run indoor track before I encourage or condone him cutting weight.

Have a great season everyone- stay safe.
Chicken Wing Coach
Fri Nov 29 2013, 07:15PM

Joined: Tue Apr 01 2008, 05:15PM
Posts: 3789
The "weight cutting" issue is only half of the equation of why I support eliminating this Wed. morning weigh-in procedure.

The other half of the equation is this: I seriously question & challenge the validity & legitimacy of this procedure. Who exactly conducts these morning weigh-ins? Is it: The Principal, the Assistant Principal, the Athletic Director, the Athletic Trainer, the Head Coach, the Assistant Coach, a Teacher, a Parent, a Nurse/School Medical Staff, or possibly the Wrestlers themselves? Is the designated official the same for every school involved or is it different types of people for different schools? From my understanding, there are huge disparities.

The potential to cheat the system exists. Even if 99% of coaches are 100% honest about following this procedure by the book, using the exact rules; if there is 1% (a single coach or designee) who deviates from the procedure, then the system is compromised & flawed.

This is what I'm claiming here. I believe that the system is flawed because it is NOT regulated!

Here's my disclaimer: I'm not accusing every coach of cheating the system & I apologize if it appears that I'm doing so. I know that there are a lot of very honest coaches out there who follow this procedure 100%. But, I'm not going to continue to pretend or act naively & believe that there aren't any coaches out there that aren't lying about wrestlers who supposedly showed up in the morning & made "full scratch weight"?

I know some people will be offended by my accusations & they will defend their coaches & programs as being ultra honest. But, let's be realistic & ask if anyone wonders about the legitimacy of some opposing coaches or teams?

This honor system is NOT regulated (& until it is) I suggest & recommend that we eliminate this morning weigh-in practice. I'm sick & tired of the "CHARADE" & I'm going to continue to fight to get rid of it for both reasons. As I've previously stated: Wed. morning Weigh-Ins are BOGUS. Everybody needs to make scratch (twice a week) with both opposing coaches that are physically present at the evening weigh-ins.
Chicken Wing Coach
Fri Nov 29 2013, 07:32PM

Joined: Tue Apr 01 2008, 05:15PM
Posts: 3789
To: "WICH1149" who said:
"No matter what we do, kids will always be cutting weight. To think that this will somehow stop is just plain silly. It may prevent huge cuts but it will never eliminate it."

*Here's my response to that statement:
I'm not completely stupid (although some may debate it). I know & realize that there will always be a degree of cutting weight in this sport that is advocated & supported by some coaches & wrestlers. I know I won't be able to stop weight cutting. But, what I'm trying to do here exactly: Is to stop the Wed. morning weigh-in practice as it is a by-product of abuse (both changing the weight class & not having a legitimate/regulated weigh-in! And yes, I believe it will also prevent those from being at a weight class that they shouldn't be at in the first place.
Chicken Wing Coach
Fri Nov 29 2013, 07:48PM

Joined: Tue Apr 01 2008, 05:15PM
Posts: 3789
This is my stand on "weight cutting": The Effects & Risks of Extreme Weight Loss on the Body of a Wrestler: [link]

NCAA article - "Wrestling Away from a Troubled Past" (It's all related): [link]
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