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NABC

Mon Feb 27 2012, 09:18PM

Registered Member #907
Joined: Thu Dec 23 2004, 03:04PM
Posts: 450

[quote]

From Mass, Methuen sends 4. Natick sends 4. Next Dracut with 3..... Tough to compete with the current qualifiers.

/quote1330398884]

North Andover is sending four as well (should have been at least 2 more...)

durfeecoach130

Mon Feb 27 2012, 10:43PM

Registered Member #10803
Joined: Sat Jan 08 2011, 07:47PM
Posts: 66

dbreen wrote ...

For a mass kid to qualify for NE's, he would have wrestled a minimum of 11 and some kids 16-18 times over the past three weeks. The VT 126 who took third was 1-1 in post season comp. And people think this is fair?

GREAT POINT!!

coachskp

Tue Feb 28 2012, 05:39AM

Registered Member #847
Joined: Wed Dec 15 2004, 11:37AM
Posts: 754

Does anyone know what happened to Lash

gnussbaum

Tue Feb 28 2012, 05:46AM

Registered Member #824
Joined: Mon Dec 13 2004, 07:36PM
Posts: 607

didn't make weight for states

Hit The Tickets

Tue Feb 28 2012, 05:59AM

Registered Member #11705
Joined: Wed Feb 15 2012, 11:54AM
Posts: 15

raiders1983a wrote ...

My New England Predictions:

106:
Semis: Benevides(MA) vs Alteiri(RI)
Ryan(MA) vs Lemieux(NH)
Finals: Benevides(MA) vs Ryan(MA)
113:
Semis: Elecier(MA) vs Monserrat(MA)
Bridson(NH) vs Robinson(MA)
Finals: Monserrat(MA) vs Bridson(NH)
120:
Semis: Lacroix(MA) vs Keane(CT)
Leblanc(MA) vs Mui(MA)
Finals: Keane(CT) vs Mui(MA)
126:
Semis: Sughrue(MA) vs Vicente(RI)
Do(MA) vs Oboyle(MA)
Finals: Sughrue(MA) vs Oboyle(MA)
132:
Semis: Calixto(CT) vs Hale(VT)
Burnham(NH) vs Stewart(MA)
Finals: Calixto(CT) vs Stewart(MA)
138:
Semis: Smith(MA) vs Viruet(MA)
Pratt(MA) vs Hoehn(MA)
Finals: Smith(MA) vs Hoehn(MA)
145:
Semis: Burke(NH) vs Doherty(MA)
Odell(CT) vs Janes(ME)
Finals: Doherty(MA) vs Odell(CT)
152:
Semis: Marcoux-Schaefer(VT) vs Jenson(ME)
Niven(MA) vs McKeever(CT)
Finals: Jenson(ME) vs Niven(MA)
160:
Semis: Scmeider(RI) vs Straight(MA)
Conrad(MA) vs Therrien(MA)
Finals: Straight(MA) vs Conrad(MA)
170:
Semis: London(MA) vs Kordana(MA)
Grant(VT) vs Henson(MA)
Finals: Kordana(MA) vs Henson(MA)
182:
Semis: Salois(RI) vs Dubin(MA)
Foucher(VT) vs Giblin(MA)
Finals: Salois(RI) vs Foucher(VT)
195:
Semis: Valentin(NH) vs Trindade(MA)
Riggins(CT) vs Foucher(VT)
Finals: Trindade(MA) vs Riggens(CT)
220:
Semis: Usmanov(MA) vs Simula(NH)
Fredericks(MA) vs Marinan(CT)
Finals: Usmanov(MA) vs Fredericks(MA)
285:
Semis: Ferrer(MA) vs Demichelle(CT)
Battles-Santos(MA) vs Webb(VT)
Finals: Demichelle(CT) vs Battles-Santos(MA)

Marcoux-Schaefer in the semi-finals? He came in 8th at Lowell, so not to discredit him, but this seems like an oversight unless he has turned it on and been wrestling like an animal in the post season.

suckertilt43

Tue Feb 28 2012, 07:50AM

Registered Member #11579
Joined: Wed Feb 01 2012, 09:29AM
Posts: 5

[quote]
[quote]
Vermont has 23 registered teams, largest bracket at states had 13 kids, 126 had 5 kids, majority had 8 or 9 kids.

[link]

[link]
[/quote1330376929]

Total joke, they should not get three entries, it is an unfair advantage long term and while their program is legit the way they qualify so many for the New England's is not nor would I be bragging so much about having a State Champ out of 5 kids in weight class in VT with only 23 teams total and only MAU having a full team. Seriously, the amount of entrants needs to change per state, it gets brought up every year but no one seems to want to change anything.

[/quote1330435996]

I think we should rename the New England Tournament
The " Lets Stick it to Vermont Tournament". Every year this get brought up- Lets be honest I think you guys are a little jealous you never qualify as many as Timberlane and or MAU. Come to think about it why don't we see more teams from Maine and RI qualifying more kids? In Maine you need to win an 8 man bracket at their divisional. I almost hear no one complain about that. My guess would be that their teams aren't as good as those two. I think Every state should send their top 3. Hows that for fair and equitable? This is a sport based on giving the little guy a chance. We don't exclude people from this sport, unless they have a skin infection- but that's a different story (Right Mass Coaches). The tournament is already stacked in favor of a mass or Ct. kid placing, oh unless they aren't as good as some smaller state's 3rd seed.

coachskp

Tue Feb 28 2012, 08:05AM

Registered Member #847
Joined: Wed Dec 15 2004, 11:37AM
Posts: 754

possible tough qrtrs matches - i am sure there are others
113 - Monserrat v Kirkegard - finals rematch from 103 last year
120 - Mui v Crisco - Crisco third last year
David v Rheaume first round - winner against Schramm - winner aganst Keene in the Qtrs- (last years Champ)
last year - Rheaume beat Schramm in the first round and David knocked Rheaume out of the tourney (Schramm and David each won three matches)
132 Hale v Tamaradze third and fifth last year - I believe Hale has won the only match up this year - last year they split at NEs Mizam won in the second round Hale won in the consi semis - winner likely to see Calixto in the Semis (4th last year)
138 Hoehn v Labrie
152 - Niven v Page - Lowell finals rematch i know Niven pinned and I didn't see it but Page was winning after the first period and it was tied after two

Hit The Tickets

Tue Feb 28 2012, 08:17AM

Registered Member #11705
Joined: Wed Feb 15 2012, 11:54AM
Posts: 15

Niven wrestled pretty listlessly until the third period than he turned it on and was too much for Page to handle, but we'll see what happens.... Viruet beat Labrie in the Lowell finals, and Hoehn has beaten Viruet twice, so going by a common opponent, Hoehn should take that match.... I really wouldn't be surprised to see Smith v. Hoehn for a third time.

mray

Tue Feb 28 2012, 08:19AM

Registered Member #278
Joined: Mon Jan 16 2006, 10:06AM
Posts: 934

Beemer

Tue Feb 28 2012, 08:52AM

Registered Member #5397
Joined: Tue Feb 06 2007, 12:00PM
Posts: 98

Medic5392 wrote ...

The Duals would be awesome but it would be one more tournament to add on, I don't see it happening due to that. Something has to be done, I get MAU is a good program but it only helps when your guys get that much exposure early on and hurts states with much tougher qualifiers like MA and CT. Even ME and NH have far more teams than VT, it is a terrible way to qualify.
The duals would be a great change but something else would have to give I think in order for that to be initiated. I cannot get the Council to return emails or phone calls with a possible offer of sponsorship so good luck getting them to do that.

In terms of the extra tournament...I somewhat agree...but you could have the individual tourney Fri-Sat...and the team duals Sunday. One day tournament like the team sectioanls were in the past . May coast some kids a day of school, but I'm sure many would have no problem living with that. The issue lies with every state instituting their own divisional state dual tourneys to come up with the qualifiers.

wrestlingfanne

Tue Feb 28 2012, 08:57AM

Registered Member #11580
Joined: Wed Feb 01 2012, 10:55AM
Posts: 11

I dont think anyone would argue that it CAN and usually is easier to qualify for New Englands in VT, ME, and RI. However, if this is about "team scores" people need to realize that MAU and Timberlane kids have to win at NE to earn advancement points. If they do, it only stands to reason that they would have made thier way through the qualification process of thier opponents state. Right? Right! These teams compete at the New England level becasue they place kids at New Englands. They place kids at New Englands becasue they work hard and beat other kids from other states (which includes that states qualificatin process)..... its that simple. The same kids earning points for MAU and Timblerlane at the New England Tournament would have qualified in the other states and had the same oppurtunity to earn points at New Englands. If there are kids in VT, ME, and Ri that wouldn't have qualified they wont advance and earn points.

NausetGrandpa

Tue Feb 28 2012, 08:58AM

Registered Member #10058
Joined: Thu Feb 18 2010, 11:59AM
Posts: 72

Got email from Craig Blanchard, NE Tournament coordinator... he will be posting on Twitter as in past years... semis and finals will be live

plm_77

Tue Feb 28 2012, 08:59AM

Registered Member #266
Joined: Sat Apr 03 2004, 03:51PM
Posts: 201

Mass 160 teams take top 7

Maine 60 teams
Vermont 22 teams
New Hampshire 22 teams

Should wrestle a qualifer take top 4

Connecticut 100 teams
Rhode Island 30 teams

Should wrestle a qualifer take top 5

or double it all and take 32 to new englands.

plm_77

Tue Feb 28 2012, 09:00AM

Registered Member #266
Joined: Sat Apr 03 2004, 03:51PM
Posts: 201

wrestlingfanne wrote ...

I dont think anyone would argue that it CAN and usually is easier to qualify for New Englands in VT, ME, and RI. However, if this is about "team scores" people need to realize that MAU and Timberlane kids have to win at NE to earn advancement points. If they do, it only stands to reason that they would have made thier way through the qualification process of thier opponents state. Right? Right! These teams compete at the New England level becasue they place kids at New Englands. They place kids at New Englands becasue they work hard and beat other kids from other states (which includes that states qualificatin process)..... its that simple. The same kids earning points for MAU and Timblerlane at the New England Tournament would have qualified in the other states and had the same oppurtunity to earn points at New Englands. If there are kids in VT, ME, and Ri that wouldn't have qualified they wont advance and earn points.

You have to realize that a kid from MAU or Timberlane comes into the NE in much better condition, because they wrestle in a much weaker state. The Finals of VT or NH State finals is the equivalent of a D3 Sectional.

Koondow

Tue Feb 28 2012, 09:05AM

Registered Member #10400
Joined: Fri Jul 09 2010, 01:49PM
Posts: 23

I saw the Vt State's this past weekend. Very good tournament. Here's a heads up---Geoffrey Grant @170 and Riley Simoneau @220 (non MAU kids) are beasts.
The rest of the Vermont qualifiers are pretty decent, too. MAU is, of course, very formidable. It wouldn't matter where they came from, the coaching staff and the youth feeder program have made the team what they are. They should win New Englands. Because they are great, not because of what whiners would have you believe.."it's not fair...waaaaa"
New Englands is a great tournament. I look forward to it. Good luck to all the wrestlers who have made it this far!!!

T_189

Tue Feb 28 2012, 09:10AM

Registered Member #6394
Joined: Sun Nov 04 2007, 08:38PM
Posts: 720

I think conneticute will have the most champs/place winners this year.

Carlascooz

Tue Feb 28 2012, 09:11AM

Registered Member #11519
Joined: Sun Jan 22 2012, 09:43PM
Posts: 106

wrestlingfanne wrote ...

people need to realize that MAU and Timberlane kids have to win at NE to earn advancement points. If they do, it only stands to reason that they would have made thier way through the qualification process of thier opponents state. Right? Right!

No. A VT\NH kid who can win a match or two at NEs wouldn't necessarily quailify for NEs in MA. A VT kid winning a match at NEs simply means that he has the *potential* to qualify if he were in MA. There's a big difference between winning one match against a NE qualifier and placing top 6 in 3 separate qualifying tournaments.

I'll use myself as an example. I was a NE qualifier from NH. I went 2-2 at NEs. But during the regular season I lost to the kid who ended up being MA #6. So even though I won 2 at NEs I wouldn't necessarily have qualified if I lived in MA.

Out of curiosity, did they run the VT states on 1 mat or two this year?

Carlascooz

Tue Feb 28 2012, 09:16AM

Registered Member #11519
Joined: Sun Jan 22 2012, 09:43PM
Posts: 106

Koondow wrote ...

It wouldn't matter where they came from, the coaching staff and the youth feeder program have made the team what they are. They should win New Englands. Because they are great, not because of what whiners would have you believe.."it's not fair...waaaaa"

I don't think anybody said they aren't good. Our only point is that they have more qualifiers since it's easier to qualify in VT. There's no arguing against that. MA has close to 200 teams (?) and sends 6 to NEs. VT has 23 teams and sends 3 to NEs. So of course MAU is going to have an advantage.

nb135

Tue Feb 28 2012, 09:22AM

Registered Member #6515
Joined: Sun Dec 09 2007, 09:42AM
Posts: 933

plm_77 wrote ...

idk what that has to do with being in better condition

mray

Tue Feb 28 2012, 09:26AM

Registered Member #278
Joined: Mon Jan 16 2006, 10:06AM
Posts: 934

nb135 wrote ...

plm_77 wrote ...

idk what that has to do with being in better condition

I think he means that they aren't as beat up as the Mass. kids.

WestSide87

Tue Feb 28 2012, 09:32AM

Registered Member #8572
Joined: Fri Jan 23 2009, 12:29PM
Posts: 204

[quote]
[quote]
[quote]
Vermont has 23 registered teams, largest bracket at states had 13 kids, 126 had 5 kids, majority had 8 or 9 kids.

[link]

[link]
[/quote1330376929]

Total joke, they should not get three entries, it is an unfair advantage long term and while their program is legit the way they qualify so many for the New England's is not nor would I be bragging so much about having a State Champ out of 5 kids in weight class in VT with only 23 teams total and only MAU having a full team. Seriously, the amount of entrants needs to change per state, it gets brought up every year but no one seems to want to change anything.

[/quote1330435996]

I think we should rename the New England Tournament
The " Lets Stick it to Vermont Tournament". Every year this get brought up- Lets be honest I think you guys are a little jealous you never qualify as many as Timberlane and or MAU. Come to think about it why don't we see more teams from Maine and RI qualifying more kids? In Maine you need to win an 8 man bracket at their divisional. I almost hear no one complain about that. My guess would be that their teams aren't as good as those two. I think Every state should send their top 3. Hows that for fair and equitable? This is a sport based on giving the little guy a chance. We don't exclude people from this sport, unless they have a skin infection- but that's a different story (Right Mass Coaches). The tournament is already stacked in favor of a mass or Ct. kid placing, oh unless they aren't as good as some smaller state's 3rd seed.

[/quote1330440383]

"I think every state should send their top 3. Hows that for fair and equitable? This is a sport based on giving the little guy a chance. We don't exclude people from this sport (Then you throw a skin infection slap!).

Ray did a very nice job explaining things and he is right. Mass. and Conn. both give huge respect to MAU and Timberlaine, No one doubts how good they are, and that is why some of Mass and CT's best teams schedule them every year, because we know what they are, the best. That is also why they leave their states so often, because they know how far behind them the rest of their states are (especially MAU). Mau travells 2 hours multiple times a year on week day nights to Mass and CT. just to get competition! They are great! MAU, Timberlaine, Danbury, and about 1/2 dozen Mass teams who travell to NY, PA and beyond are the flagship teams of NE and put they us all on the map.

I will use a brief comparison to let you, Sucktilt, see what Mass and CT deal with. Dannbury v's MAU from 3 weeks ago. Danbury beats MAU (w/o Luciano) 33-26 in a dual, they also beat Timberlaine but I'll leave that alone.
106-Dan pins Vt. State Champ.
113- Vt. Champ 10-3 over Dan (4th at Class DNP Opens)
120- Vt. Champ 4-2 over Dan (2nd at Class DNP Opens)
126- Dan 12-2 over Vt. Champ
132- Vt. Champ pin
138- Dan 10-3 over Vt. 4
145- Vt. Champ 16-1 over (Class 5)
152- Dan 3-2 over Vt Champ (Dan 3rd Class DNP Open)
160- Dan 10-3 over Vt. 2nd (Dan 3rd Class, 5th Open)
170- Dan Pin over Vt 3 (Dan 3rd Class DNP Open)
182- Dan 8-6 over Vt Champ (Dan 3rd Class, 4th Open)
195- Vt Champ Inj over Dan
220- Dan pin over MAU (Dan 2 Class, 5th Open)
285- Vt Champ 5-0 over Dan (3rd Class 6th Open)

Both Teams are great! MAU has 10 state Champs and sends 13 to NE's. Danbury 1 state Champ and sends 2 (with 1 in a pig tail) to NE's. It's not that anyone doubts how good of a team they are, but Mass's 6 qualifiers are come from 160 teams, CT's 4 are from 120 teams, Vt's 3 qualifiers are from 22 teams, NH 3 out of about 30 teams (not sure of exact #'s).

So back to your "each state should send their top 3, Fair and equitabel, giving the little guy a chance, we don't exclude people". Statements. That is what Mass and CT people want! All the Mass and Ct. kids who are excluded, have to deal with an unfair and unequitable system, and aren't given a chance to compete because they are from bigger states; they aren't happy. This sport is about kids getting to the "next level", and right now that's New Englands. Hell, at Mass All-States they announcers tell the crowd that each kid qualifies for NE's as soon as they do it, kid wins in the 1/4's it's "he has qualified for NE's". People look at raw numbers and "the hell" of All-States that Ray talked about, and can't help but feel slighted. Sorry but that's how it is.

RJD4444

Tue Feb 28 2012, 10:11AM

Registered Member #11475
Joined: Tue Dec 20 2011, 03:09PM
Posts: 70

[quote]
[quote]
[quote]
[quote]
Vermont has 23 registered teams, largest bracket at states had 13 kids, 126 had 5 kids, majority had 8 or 9 kids.

[link]

[link]
[/quote1330376929]

Total joke, they should not get three entries, it is an unfair advantage long term and while their program is legit the way they qualify so many for the New England's is not nor would I be bragging so much about having a State Champ out of 5 kids in weight class in VT with only 23 teams total and only MAU having a full team. Seriously, the amount of entrants needs to change per state, it gets brought up every year but no one seems to want to change anything.

[/quote1330435996]

I think we should rename the New England Tournament
The " Lets Stick it to Vermont Tournament". Every year this get brought up- Lets be honest I think you guys are a little jealous you never qualify as many as Timberlane and or MAU. Come to think about it why don't we see more teams from Maine and RI qualifying more kids? In Maine you need to win an 8 man bracket at their divisional. I almost hear no one complain about that. My guess would be that their teams aren't as good as those two. I think Every state should send their top 3. Hows that for fair and equitable? This is a sport based on giving the little guy a chance. We don't exclude people from this sport, unless they have a skin infection- but that's a different story (Right Mass Coaches). The tournament is already stacked in favor of a mass or Ct. kid placing, oh unless they aren't as good as some smaller state's 3rd seed.

[/quote1330440383]

"I think every state should send their top 3. Hows that for fair and equitable? This is a sport based on giving the little guy a chance. We don't exclude people from this sport (Then you throw a skin infection slap!).

Ray did a very nice job explaining things and he is right. Mass. and Conn. both give huge respect to MAU and Timberlaine, No one doubts how good they are, and that is why some of Mass and CT's best teams schedule them every year, because we know what they are, the best. That is also why they leave their states so often, because they know how far behind them the rest of their states are (especially MAU). Mau travells 2 hours multiple times a year on week day nights to Mass and CT. just to get competition! They are great! MAU, Timberlaine, Danbury, and about 1/2 dozen Mass teams who travell to NY, PA and beyond are the flagship teams of NE and put they us all on the map.

I will use a brief comparison to let you, Sucktilt, see what Mass and CT deal with. Dannbury v's MAU from 3 weeks ago. Danbury beats MAU (w/o Luciano) 33-26 in a dual, they also beat Timberlaine but I'll leave that alone.
106-Dan pins Vt. State Champ.
113- Vt. Champ 10-3 over Dan (4th at Class DNP Opens)
120- Vt. Champ 4-2 over Dan (2nd at Class DNP Opens)
126- Dan 12-2 over Vt. Champ
132- Vt. Champ pin
138- Dan 10-3 over Vt. 4
145- Vt. Champ 16-1 over (Class 5)
152- Dan 3-2 over Vt Champ (Dan 3rd Class DNP Open)
160- Dan 10-3 over Vt. 2nd (Dan 3rd Class, 5th Open)
170- Dan Pin over Vt 3 (Dan 3rd Class DNP Open)
182- Dan 8-6 over Vt Champ (Dan 3rd Class, 4th Open)
195- Vt Champ Inj over Dan
220- Dan pin over MAU (Dan 2 Class, 5th Open)
285- Vt Champ 5-0 over Dan (3rd Class 6th Open)

Both Teams are great! MAU has 10 state Champs and sends 13 to NE's. Danbury 1 state Champ and sends 2 (with 1 in a pig tail) to NE's. It's not that anyone doubts how good of a team they are, but Mass's 6 qualifiers are come from 160 teams, CT's 4 are from 120 teams, Vt's 3 qualifiers are from 22 teams, NH 3 out of about 30 teams (not sure of exact #'s).

So back to your "each state should send their top 3, Fair and equitabel, giving the little guy a chance, we don't exclude people". Statements. That is what Mass and CT people want! All the Mass and Ct. kids who are excluded, have to deal with an unfair and unequitable system, and aren't given a chance to compete because they are from bigger states; they aren't happy. This sport is about kids getting to the "next level", and right now that's New Englands. Hell, at Mass All-States they announcers tell the crowd that each kid qualifies for NE's as soon as they do it, kid wins in the 1/4's it's "he has qualified for NE's". People look at raw numbers and "the hell" of All-States that Ray talked about, and can't help but feel slighted. Sorry but that's how it is.

[/quote1330445178]

Let me put it to you another way and maybe you will understand it a bit more. Both those teams are great teams and have been for many years, but the fact of the matter is they don't have the grind that MA and CT have. If the top teams from MA this year wrestled in the Vermont State Tournament or the tournament of Champions in NH they would be bringing a lot more than 4 wrestlers. Teams like Methuen, North Andover and a few others. It is not a fair measure of how well a TEAM does at the New Englands when they only qualify 4 wrestlers compared to the 12-14 that both MAU and Timberlane Normally bring.

I would put those teams up against both Timberlan and MAU in a dual and it would be very very close, but put them in the New England Tournament and it makes them MAU and Timberlane look like no other team can compete.

WestSide87

Tue Feb 28 2012, 10:13AM

Registered Member #8572
Joined: Fri Jan 23 2009, 12:29PM
Posts: 204

About depth and would a kid qualify. I will use my 160 who beat the MAU 160 and State 2nd 4-3 in our dual wit them.

He was a D1 West Champ by minor dec., but had lost in the dual to the Central wrestler he beat in the Sectional Final.
D1 States. in 1/4's my kid loses 6-4 (ot) to the Central Sect. runner-up who becomes Div. 1 State Finalist. wins 4-3 over South Sect. runner-up (last second TD), loses 5-4 to south section 4th (Last second TD), wins 4-0 to West Sect Finalits. 5th Place.

All-States: Loses 5-4 to D2 State Champ (who lost in SV OT in the Semi's), wins 13-7 to D2 6th, loses 8-6 (OT) to D3 3rd. That kid wins next match 11-1 against D3 4th, but then gets eliminated by the 5th place kid.

Oh Yeah, My kid lost 5-3 with a last seconf TD to The Ct. Open Champ. who was OW at LL's. in the Mass/Conn Finals. That kid was top 8 in NE's in 2011.

Their are tons of kids in every weight class in Mass and Ct, who go through this roller coaster/meat grinder!

My point is that the MAU 160 is GOOD, he will win matches in NE's, no doubt. That said, reality is that in Mass. he may not make it out of Div. States, let alone All-States. Wrestling is easy when you are winning, it's even easy to get motivated after a tough loss and keep battling especially when your TEAM's score is involved. In Mass. especially where No Team Scores are kept at Div States and All-States for a kid who has now lost 3-4-5 times in the post season by acouple points and won 3-4-5 times by a couple points to get knocked out. There are good kids in every state in NE, just CT and Mass have more due to 160 and 120 teams.

matfan09

Tue Feb 28 2012, 10:25AM

Registered Member #6068
Joined: Tue May 01 2007, 03:07PM
Posts: 57

Kirkegard dominated Monserrat in the NE finals last year before pinning him. But he dominated everybody at 106. Monserrat is a lot bigger at 113 than he was last year and Kierkegard had allot of close matches in the CT Open. Either the competition in CT is way tougher than MA or Monserrat has gotten way tougher. It'll be interesting and with Bridson in the mix it's shaping up to be one tuff weight class. Too bad last years finalists will probably meet in this years quarters though.

wmcquaide

Tue Feb 28 2012, 10:38AM

Registered Member #572
Joined: Tue Sep 14 2004, 11:57AM
Posts: 297

if vt1 at 106, loses 1st match to nh2 or ct 4, vt1 then beats vt3, and then loses to ma5. vt1 scored team points and only beat a kid that went 2-1 in the vt states.

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